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Commodore
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Last Login: Yesterday @ 18:43
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| It's all well and good having a clear out of MP's but from my own experiance of serving on Parish and a Borough Council's it is a bad thing. 1. It get's rid of a lot of experianced member's replacing them with them green horn's 2. The tail begins to wag the dog. ie. Officers take control. 3. Personally I would have performance pay. As a Cllr. I have to attend 1 meeting every 6 months to receive my allowance and there are a number who do or come very close to it. Having more MP's that come from the real world of work would be a start.
MLGLooking back to J916.
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Commodore
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Last Login: Yesterday @ 00:06
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| Derek I think the fear is that by voting in the General Election we are shifting out one lot who might or might not have milked the system and are replacing them with another lot who may or may not do the same, so you think what is the point. Personally we should all vote according to our consciences. Unfortunately we have to rely on others to ensure that fiddling of expenses claims is eradicated and at the moment there is little confidence that this is going to happen.
Gary
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Commodore
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Last Login: Today @ 07:56
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It is a pity that one ever has to post a message like this (in the spirit it is intended), but I would like to thank those who have participated in this thread to not sinking to personal invective against someone (me) who takes a more "stoical" view regarding MPs expenses and remuneration, that is probably a minority viewpoint, but may well be a correct one, in the long run.
Derek “The Monocled Mutineer” Kane
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\__/|>o<| Last cruise: Aurora R906 06/2009 Next cruise: Oriana X003 03/2010 For cruise history view "Member's interests" "The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there." - LP Hartley - The Go-Between.
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 07:41
Posts: 2,279,
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| I am as angry about this expense thing as anybody. It is a scandal and there is no doubt that some have abused the system and milked the coffers for all their worth but in the majority of cases they have been within the rules and it is the system that is wrong. How many members of 'Joe Public' who are claiming to be outraged, would not do exactly the same as they have done. If put in their position... So let's change the system and that is what that bloke, whose name I can't remember. has tried to do....and they don't like it....well believe it or not, I do have some sympathy for them here. To have an effective government you need to attract talented, capable people to the House, you need to pay them well and give them a few perks, if all you pay is peanuts then all you get are monkeys. So I don't think that 100k per annum is un reasonable but that's it, no more. For those MPs that need a second home the state could provide an apartment for them to use through out their Parliamentary career. When they leave the House then their apartment is given to their replacement. A system that they use in the States, I believe. No second homes. I don't have a problem with them employing family members, if that person is the best person for the job. After all many others do that why should an MP be any different. And if one of them breaks the rules and is found out to be a greedy so and so then that MP should be hung drawn and quartered, burnt at the stake, tared and feathered, Knee capped, made to walk the plank in a shark infested sea, drowned, decapitated and have his or her tongue cut out and if they survive all thet then they should be made to live in............(you can fill that bit in yourselves.)
Paul
Next Cruise - April 2010 on Oceana
E007 & E008
Been on -Black Watch, Boudicca, ThomsonDestiny and Ventura
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 07:41
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Sorry....that bloke who is changing the rules is Sir Christopher Kelly....Thanks Chickadee in the opening post.
Paul
Next Cruise - April 2010 on Oceana
E007 & E008
Been on -Black Watch, Boudicca, ThomsonDestiny and Ventura
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 08:51
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| If I stole from my employer, even if masked behind obscure 'rules' where I knew I was morally wrong I would be dismissed ... immediately. A large number of MPs have been caught with their hand in the cookie jar and their continual excuse of blaming the rules proves beyond any doubt that they have no proper defence and highlights the lack of moral fibre at Westminister. The employment of family members has always been a disgrace since such 'appointments' do not meet required fair recruiting policies (and, if some that I have come across are reflected across the board, it is a total 'fiddle' with the fmaily member doing little for a full time salary). I personally believe that the investigations so far have only scratched the surface of the corruption and immoral practices of this government. Like all elements of the public sector, if they want a pay rise then it must be funded 100% from within. If the MPs want more money then they need to reduce their ranks ... maybe start by reducing the number of MPs by 10-20% with a further 10-20% within a couple of terms .. similar deductions should be made in the house of lords ... that should fund any pay requirements. Why we need tier after tier of government I do not know ... councils, local government, Westminister, House of Lords, Europe, quangos etc, etc. We have been lied to and treated like fools by the government for years and it is time that the corrupt, ineffective, self-serving, immoral, liars and cheats that have sponged of the tax payer in a pretence of 'serving' them were removed from positions of power. I would also expect that incompetence in the public sector is no longer rewarded but instead results in accountability and dismissal.
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 07:56
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| Cost of the establishment of the Palace of Westminster: Whilst not condoning wrongdoing the following needs to be borne in mind: ===> | Establishment and MP's salaries & expenses. In a reply to a Lord's Question: £498.4 million for 2008/9 which equates to about £0.02 per day for every man, woman and child in the UK. (Clearly, a few pence more for every tax payer). Down from £531.8 million for 2007/8. Excellent value! ~~~ A reduction of MPs expenses say to 50% of last years levels would equate to about £0.002 per day for every man, woman and child (Base: 650x£150,000/2/70,000,000/365) Abolition of any expenses for MPs would yield circa £0.004 per day for every man, woman and child. About half a pint of beer a year per head!
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Derek “The Monocled Mutineer” Kane
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\__/|>o<| Last cruise: Aurora R906 06/2009 Next cruise: Oriana X003 03/2010 For cruise history view "Member's interests" "The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there." - LP Hartley - The Go-Between.
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 08:51
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| No matter what happens, due to public anger in relation to perceived and actual wrong doing by our leaders, one or more people need to take the fall and be seen to be taking the fall, some need to be charged with offences and 'justice' needs to be seen to be served ... without such actions faith will never be restored in the system.
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 07:56
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| There also needs to be a clear distinction between those who were fraudulently claiming what was not their due, those who were claiming within rules that were to say the least generous, and those who were claiming what can be considered as reasonable out-of-pocket expenses. The first should be undergoing investigation by the police and Customs & Revenue. However, we do have a principle of Habeas Corpus in this nation and unlike an employee, an MP cannot be "sacked" unless found guilty of a criminal act, becomes a bankrupt, is elevated to the peerage or loses at a general election (when after parliamentary dissolution he/she isn't an MP anyway). The second (as well as the first) have been written to and asked to pay back up to 5 years of what is now considered retrospectively, incorrect claims (whether fraudulent or just over generous). The third of course include those who have claimed what is now considered reasonable and have nothing to pay back.
Derek “The Monocled Mutineer” Kane
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\__/|>o<| Last cruise: Aurora R906 06/2009 Next cruise: Oriana X003 03/2010 For cruise history view "Member's interests" "The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there." - LP Hartley - The Go-Between.
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Commodore
Group: Members
Last Login: Today @ 07:56
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| For folk (and not just MPs) who have two homes in the UK, presumably there has always been the provision to be able to "flip" one home as being your main home. The interesting question would be what is the Customs & Revenue guidance as to how often one can do this.
Derek “The Monocled Mutineer” Kane
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\__/|>o<| Last cruise: Aurora R906 06/2009 Next cruise: Oriana X003 03/2010 For cruise history view "Member's interests" "The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there." - LP Hartley - The Go-Between.
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